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Author Topic: Case of the Scorpion's Tail / La coda dello scorpione (Sergio Martino, 1971)  (Read 4502 times)

bdc

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Recently watched this and enjoyed this Martino thriller/giallo a lot.
I also liked seeing Janine Reynaud in this one.
I watched the Noshame disc which has some motion blurring problems (pal-ntsc transfer).
However there are some nice extra's included.
Anyway thinking about getting the French Neo dvd.
I've read it has an audio-commentary by Ernesto Gastaldi.

 
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Stuart Chivers

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I'm guessing there aren't any English options with the Neo DVD?

This is one of my favourite Martino gialli, btw.
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Jonny

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Yeah, one of my faves too. Quality film through and through.

One thing I don't get is all this discussion of motion blur with the NoShame discs. Maybe my eyes are fucked but they seem fine to me. Mind you I only have a medium size 16:9 CRT TV so maybe these things don't show up as bad on my set, if that's the case I doubt I'll bother upgrading to a larger screen anytime soon...
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Letterboxd - "Henry Silva has a small zoo at home and his weapon of choice is a bazooka"

bdc

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I'm guessing there aren't any English options with the Neo DVD?

This is one of my favourite Martino gialli, btw.
I also like it a lot.
No English options unfortunately.
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bdc

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Yeah, one of my faves too. Quality film through and through.

One thing I don't get is all this discussion of motion blur with the NoShame discs. Maybe my eyes are fucked but they seem fine to me. Mind you I only have a medium size 16:9 CRT TV so maybe these things don't show up as bad on my set, if that's the case I doubt I'll bother upgrading to a larger screen anytime soon...
Maybe it's caused by the set-up?
You got some kind of progressive scan/de-interlacer hooked up?
I definitely noticed this on my old-school 4:3 tv.
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Jonny

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Maybe it's caused by the set-up?
You got some kind of progressive scan/de-interlacer hooked up?
I definitely noticed this on my old-school 4:3 tv.


No, just a DVD recorder and a TV. It's highly likely I'm missing it because I'm so used to seeing these film via old VHS recordings that my brain is only seeing the improvements and doesn't pick up on any defects.

I've never been one to notice artifacting or any of the things some reviewers take great pains to point out in reviews. I guess I'm very easily pleased!
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Letterboxd - "Henry Silva has a small zoo at home and his weapon of choice is a bazooka"

Stuart Chivers

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Those early No Shame disks seem to look worse on higher spec equipment, which I think is due to the interlacing rather the the PAL-NTSC conversion (although Marc would probably be the person to ask). They looked great on my old CRT TV, but rubbish via my projector. I've since upgraded to a HD LCD TV, and they look fine via SCART but rubbish via HDMI.
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MarcMorris

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Interlaced DVDs work best on old CRT sets. Progressive DVDs are intended for modern LCD and Plasma screens.
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eiren

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I thought all DVDs should be stored at 480i or 587i on disc? Otherwise the DVD player would have to re-interlace to produce a signal for non-progressive video connections i.e. scart. Cheap DVD players will no doubt make a huge mess of this, or the DVD just wont work at all on a non-progressive scan player.

I've got a video processor (DVDO EDGE) that will reprocess progressive material to extract the original interlaced fields, and then deinterlace properly. Works a treat on the Noshame discs.

You should have no problem with them providing you have something with good deinterlacing on it.

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I've since upgraded to a HD LCD TV, and they look fine via SCART but rubbish via HDMI

That's likely because scart will be sending out 480i and the HDMI will be sending out a poorly deinterlaced 480p signal. If you can force 480i/576i out of your DVD player via HDMI, that would fix the problem.

If anyone has Sky HD and wants to see poor deinterlacing in action... go to the standard definition Bloomberg news channel and witness all the combing and stuttering caused by poor deinterlacing in the Sky HD boxes. Same effect.
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ecc

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I thought all DVDs should be stored at 480i or 587i on disc? Otherwise the DVD player would have to re-interlace to produce a signal for non-progressive video connections i.e. scart. Cheap DVD players will no doubt make a huge mess of this, or the DVD just wont work at all on a non-progressive scan player.

I've got a video processor (DVDO EDGE) that will reprocess progressive material to extract the original interlaced fields, and then deinterlace properly. Works a treat on the Noshame discs.

You should have no problem with them providing you have something with good deinterlacing on it.

Quote
I've since upgraded to a HD LCD TV, and they look fine via SCART but rubbish via HDMI

That's likely because scart will be sending out 480i and the HDMI will be sending out a poorly deinterlaced 480p signal. If you can force 480i/576i out of your DVD player via HDMI, that would fix the problem.

If anyone has Sky HD and wants to see poor deinterlacing in action... go to the standard definition Bloomberg news channel and witness all the combing and stuttering caused by poor deinterlacing in the Sky HD boxes. Same effect.

In NTSC-land, proper film transfers are progressive 23.976 but there is a file flag that tells the DVD player top perform pulldown on the fly.  When a PAL transfer is standards converted to NTSC it is field-blended from 25 fps to 29.976.  It's going to be interlaced anyway and it will look better on an interlaced setup.  Deinterlacing this type of image will reveal ghosting (you'll also see ghosting on hard-telecined NTSC film material).

eiren

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The original source film material is 24fps progressive, but I thought it's still put onto the DVD disc as 480i/60 with a Film flag placed onto it, as oppossed to a Video mode flag (that would indicate 60Hz in NTSC land or 50Hz in PAL land). So the DVD still contains Interlaced content, but with an additional flag to inform deinterlacers that the material should be interlaced as Film as opposed to Video.

Obviously 24 does not fit into 60 uniformly, so NTSC land has always had micro judder on their films (3:2 pulldown judder). That's not the case with PAL material as 25fps material can fit uniformly into 50Hz signals.

I know that my video processor can then detect the original 24fps in the 60Hz signal, and extract the 24fps and display like that. Also Pioneer plasma screens can do this conversion/extraction when you enable Pure Cinema mode processing.

What I am basically querying is that there aren't actually any DVDs that are 480p or 576p are there?

I definitely agree that the PAL -> NTSC standards conversion causes some terrible ghosting artefacts, and there's not much you can do about that. Those are a big shame.
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ecc

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Film material can be soft-telecined (encoding is done at 23.976 and the flag is added afterwards - though some encoders add it during the encoding but its not hard-telecined - the flag tells the DVD player to perform pulldown - recent NTSC DVD players have a progressive mode that can be turned on or off) or hard-telecined to DVD.
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